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Forum Home > Discoveries & Corrections > Discoveries and Corrections - Section 9

LJP
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Posts: 72

VINCE ZIZAK


The NFL credits G Vince Zizak (Villanova) playing 2 games with the Bears in 1934, before joining the Eagles (1934-1937).


He was a backup G for the Bears in the 31-Aug-1934 game against the College All-Stars. He is also listed in the program for the game against the East Chicago/Indiana Harbor Gophers the following week, but doesn't appear to be mentioned after that.


As far as I am aware, he is not mentioned in the newspaper reports or lineups for the Bears first two games at Green Bay and Cincinnati and there is no mention of him in any of the later programs or lineups either.


The roster cutdown to 22 was around the start of October, so he may well have been with the Bears and did not play, before the cutdown. He joined the Eagles at some point and played 6 games with them in 1934.


Curious to know how/why the NFL lists him playing 2 games with the Bears?


Any ideas?


October 24, 2017 at 8:14 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

BILL HURST


Hurst was with the Chicago Bears in the early part of 1924 and played backup RG in the exhibition game against the Packers on 21-Sep-1924. He subsequently joined the Kenosha Maroons and played in 5 games with them in 1924.


Various sources record his date of birth as 23-Jun-1903 and a vague date of death (SSDI) as Nov-1966. The Ohio Death Index has a corresponding entry for this William Hurst, with his date of death as 29-Nov-1966 in Berea. He was buried in Brook Park.


Was that actually the player though?


In the buildup to the Bears-Packers game, Hurst is listed as an Oregon player. A Bill Hurst did letter at Oregon, but that was in 1974-75, so obviously not the same person. Oregon State have nobody by that name on their letterwinners list. OK, so maybe he didn't letter, or maybe attended another school, or was just from Oregon.


Complicating things, some sources list his place of birth as Rock Island IL, whereas the NFL says that it was Pendlebury England. The UKs General Register Office does have a corresponding birth entry in the third quarter (births had to be registered within 6 weeks, so someone born in June could have been registered in July or August) of 1903 for a William Hurst in the Salford registration district (which covered Pendlebury), but whether that is the same person or not is not obviously clear.


Any ideas?

October 27, 2017 at 4:53 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: HURST

Located a fairly detailed family tree on Ancestry.com that mentions that the Bill Hurst who was born in Pendlebury was the same person that died in Berea.


The Hurst family arrived in Boston in 1913 and settled in Pawtucket RI. Bill is there on the 1920, 1930 & 1940 census records, working in the textile industry. The 1940 census indicates he left school after the 8th grade.


Still unclear as to whether this is the player or not? If it is, then presumably at some point Rhode Island & Rock Island have been mixed up? Not sure where the Oregon reference comes in to it?


Also on the Kenosha Maroons 1924 team was Pard Pearce, who played with the Staleys/Bears in 1920-1922 and was from Providence. Was there a connection between the two that sent Hurst to the Bears and subsequently the Maroons?

October 28, 2017 at 6:09 AM Flag Quote & Reply

steve j
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Posts: 177
November 2, 2017 at 3:52 PM Flag Quote & Reply

steve j
Member
Posts: 177

LJP

    Thanks for all your contributions.  I doubt that the guy from England is the player.  In all the research I've done, in almost every case where the person listed was born in a foreign country, it's not the right guy. I'm trying to research the right one, but no luck so far.  There is another player that I'm interested in, who played in that same Bears-Packer exhibition game in 1924 - the one listed as Glen Greenwood, who also played for the 1926 Louisvile Colonels (the road team from Chicago). Glen Greenwood was an assistant coach and practicing doctor in Iowa around that time.  An article in a Louisville newspaper of 1935 lists the 1926 player as H Greenwood of Chicago.  There was a Greenwood who played as a running back for the Waukegan Elks and other Chicago area semi-pro teams during that time, but I can't find any data on him.  Any ideas?  Thanks.

                                            Steve J

November 2, 2017 at 4:03 PM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: GREENWOOD


Steve, in the buildup to the Bears-Packers pre-season game, the Wisconsin papers list Greenwood as a "Chicago" player, which could suggest a semi-pro type player. Whilst he appeared in the game as a subsititute there does not appear to be any other mention of him.


Glen Greenwood lettered at the University of Iowa in 1917-1918. Their media guide records him as the one that played for the Bears, although that could easily be an error. Greenwood was coaching at Iowa in late September 1924 (Iowa City Press-Citizen, 27-Sep-1924).


Another puzzle.



November 3, 2017 at 6:08 PM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Lost my access to the Chicago Tribune archives recently when it moved over to the Newspapers.com platform, but doing some constructive searches on the new site, there was a Greenwood playing HB for the Chicago Blues in 1923.


Given that in 1924 the Bears also had "Chicago" player Harry O'Connell from the Opal A.A. it would suggest that this is more likely to be the Greenwood than Glen Greenwood, who was a 28-year old Doctor at that point.


Is there any actual evidence that the Greenwood with the Louisville Colonels was Glen Greenwood?

November 3, 2017 at 6:58 PM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: HURST


As far as his brief career with the Bears went, maybe I've missed it, but I don't think that there is an actual contemporary reference to him as William or Bill Hurst. In the very few times he is mentioned, it is just as Hurst, Oregon. Some modern sources appear to refer to him as "Pep" Hurst.


Is the "Oregon" referece a little misleading? as there is a city called Oregon in Ogle County, Illinois (~25 miles SW of Rockford). Some sources indicate Hurst was born in Rock Island (~90 miles SW of Oregon). So, was Hurst just another local semi-pro type?

November 3, 2017 at 8:19 PM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: HURST


Additional:- Carthage College of Kenosha had a Kenneth Hurst letter in football from 1920 to 1922. He is listed in the lineup against Monmouth on 28-Oct-1922 as RG.


???

November 3, 2017 at 8:32 PM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: HURST


Another one I don't have access to, but the Racine Journal News of 04-Oct-1924 has a list of the Kenosha Maroons players. From the OCR I don't think that it includes first names, but can't be sure. Hurst is listed as the LT, 202lbs and again from "Oregon".


The Kenneth Hurst from Carthage College was a Kenneth Arnold Hurst (1901-1966) who was born in Chicago and died in Racine. He is listed in the Carthage yearbook as being 177lbs, so possibly not the same person.


"Oregon" again? There is one in Wisconsin too, just south of Madison.

November 4, 2017 at 7:59 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: GREENWOOD


The Davenport Democrat & Leader of 25-Sep-1924 mentions Greenwood amongst the Bears players for the upcoming game at Rock Island. Again he is a "Chicago" player. Their issue of 28-Sep-1924 does not list Greenwood, although at 15 players the list is incomplete (Johnny Bryan not listed, but played. Harry Englund was reportedly still with the Bears too). The roster limit was 18 at the time.


In the buildup to the Louisville Colonels game against the Canton Bulldogs the Canton Daily News lists Greenwood as a "Chicago" player and their issue of 30-Sep-1926 goes as far to say "...extra backfield man will be Greenwood of Chicago University".


November 5, 2017 at 6:00 AM Flag Quote & Reply

steve j
Member
Posts: 177

LJP,

         I will try to respond to your entries concerning Hurst and Greenwood, but since I'm working from a library computer, I will have to be brief. I don't think either Hurst or Greenwood is the player listed in the Encyclopedia, or on any other websites.  There was a running back named Greenwood who played from 1922 to 1928 for several Chicago area teams, including Opal AA, Chicago Blues, Waukegan Elks, and Evanston Elks.  He seemed to be a rather prominent Midwest League player, and I think he is the guy who played in the 1924 pre-season Bears game, and the 1926 Louisville game.   He is listed as H Greenwood, and I located a Harold Greenwood who lived in Evanston, and possibly fit the profile, but his son said that his father never played football.  As for Hurst, I had contacted the son of Kenneth Hurst of Carthage College last year, but he said his father never played pro ball. However, I have actually encountered family members who were unaware of a relative's football career, and considering how bad some of these teams were, maybe it's not surprising. You seem to be really into the research, so here is my personal email address srjubyna@hotmail.com, in case you are interested, rather than having to put everything into the Forums.  Thanks.

                                                   Steve J

November 6, 2017 at 1:55 PM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: GREENWOOD


DePaul University in Chicago had a Greenwood on their football team in 1924. He played briefly as LE and LHB. The 1925 DePaulian yearbook mentions him, although he did not appear to letter. There are additional references to him in the 1924 DePaulia student newsletter too, but all just say Greenwood with no mention of first name, initials, etc. There doesn't appear any earlier or later references to him at DePaul - http://digicol.lib.depaul.edu/cdm/search


Would seem like a very strong candidate for the semi-pro player and Bears/Colonels player?

November 11, 2017 at 7:46 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

ED KALLINA


Another puzzler. The NFL and other sources credit Ed Kallina of Texas State playing 4 games with the Bears in 1928. There is a Kallina (Kalina, Kolina, etc) mentioned in the Bears lineups for several games (I have him appearing in 5) but very little else. He has not been listed in any of the programs that I have seen and there seems to be little else written about him.


Ed Kallina did play football at Southwest Texas State Teachers College (now Texas State), but that was in 1922-23. He also played basketball and baseball too. He has a documented minor league baseball career from 1925-1930 and was with Toledo and Abilene in 1928.


Not much to go on, but it seems a bit odd to me that Big Ed would be the player who showed up with the Bears in 1928.


A better candidate is probably his younger brother Henry Kallina (Henry Edward Kallina b.10-Jan-1904 d.13-May-1983), who played football at STSTC from 1923-1926.


Any ideas?

November 13, 2017 at 11:44 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

ED HEALEY


Ed's bio in a Bears 1925 program says he played football at Springfield MA High School (1911-1914), before attending Pomfret (CT) School (1915) where he also played football. He was at Dartmouth College (1916, 1917 & 1919). In 1918 he was in the 89th Division A.E.F.

November 18, 2017 at 5:15 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: KALLINA


For what it's worth, "Big Ed" Kallina is recorded as 6'2" whereas the NFL lists the Kallina who played for the Bears as 6'0". Ed's brother was known as "Little Henry".

November 19, 2017 at 5:53 AM Flag Quote & Reply

steve j
Member
Posts: 177

LJP at November 19, 2017 at 5:53 AM

Re: KALLINA


For what it's worth, "Big Ed" Kallina is recorded as 6'2" whereas the NFL lists the Kallina who played for the Bears as 6'0". Ed's brother was known as "Little Henry".

LJP,

         This is a really interesting one.  From what I've seen so far, I doubt that the player is either Ed Kallina or his brother.  I will be looking at this one extensively in the next few days.  Thanks.

                                                                            Steve J

November 20, 2017 at 11:08 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: KALINA


Ed Kallina was with the MLB New York Giants early in 1927. The Brooklyn Daily Eagle of 30-Jan-1927 mentions that he transferred from STSTC to the University of Illinois. An Edward James Kallina did receive a Bachelor of Science Degree in Education in February 1926 from Illinois. Ed was also at Sam Houston Normal Institute (1919-1920), before STSTC (1921-1923).


A 23-Sep-1948 article in the Chicago Tribune does mention Ed Kallina played with the Bears. Just seem to be lacking any contemporary references to the 1928 player being the same person. There were others around (Hammond, East Chicago...)


??

November 20, 2017 at 4:39 PM Flag Quote & Reply

steve j
Member
Posts: 177

LJP,

        After looking at the Tribune article from 1948, I'm sure that this is the right guy.  I wanted to find some documentation that appeared before the 1990's that connected the guy from Texas with the Bears.  Your mention of that article provided it. Thanks.

                               Steve J

November 22, 2017 at 10:59 AM Flag Quote & Reply

LJP
Member
Posts: 72

Re: KALLINA


Could be, but it could easily be an error and the source of the future references to him being the player. The article mentions that he was a "University of Illinois football player" but I can find no record of him playing football (or baseball) for the Illini. His entry in the 1927 Illio doesn't mention any sporting affiliations.


Ed Kallina is mentioned a lot in the Texas newspapers, so it seems a little odd that there is no contemporary mention there of him playing pro football. His obituary doesn't mention any pro football either.


Need to see more 1928 Bears programs really. If he is listed in them at all it will probably be around the Week 5-7 (Green Bay, Detroit, NY Yankees) games, which were all at Wrigley Field and the Kallina played in two of these. I know he is not listed in the Week 8 program vs Dayton (even though he played in the game).


Will keep digging.

November 23, 2017 at 5:51 AM Flag Quote & Reply

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